ABOUT THE CANADIAN FACTOR OF UKRAINE’S EUROPEAN INTEGRATION
Mykola Siruk
29 November, 2012 - 00:00
Ihor BARDYN: What courses should we complete to be ready for the rule of law
On the last weekend of November Kyiv Mohyla Academy hosted a conference “Model of Ukraine” titled “Different Roads to the Rule of Law.” One of the initiators and organizers of this conference, which was held for the fourth time, is the director of the Canadian-Ukrainian Parliamentary Program Ihor Bardyn – Canadian citizen of Ukrainian origin. He was born in Poland: his parents escaped there from Galicia after the World War II. And in 1950 his parents moved to Canada, where Bardyn received a law degree. First two years he worked in the law firm and then he opened his own firm, which employs 14 lawyers (half of whom are Ukrainians) and 25 people working as an assistant staff. This is the average for Canadian standards firm which is, at the same time, the largest Ukrainian law firm by the number of Ukrainians working for it. In his interview for The Day Mr. Bardyn told what prompted him to initiate the establishment of a parliamentary program and how he sees the prospects of the rule of law in Ukraine.
“Twenty-two years ago there were two events in Canada that gave the Ukrainians reason to celebrate. On the one hand, Canadian government organized a centennial celebration of Ukrainian immigration to Canada. And, on the other hand, at that time Ukraine proclaimed its independence.
“I already knew what was going on in Ukraine at that time because I had visited the country in 1990 as a part of Amnesty International mission. I defended Stepan Khmara, who was a prisoner of conscience.
“Then after the Khmara’s trial I realized that lots of work needs to be done here and many things need to be changed. One thing is to change the landscape, structure, while changing the outlook and mentality, especially those of young people, is a completely different thing. That is why I suggested to the Canadian government to create a program of student exchange between Canada and Ukraine.
“The relevant Canadian authority accepted this proposal but did not allocated funds. I was very disappointed and then I decided to raise money on my own. I was lucky to have friends who could afford to donate money and as a result I collected one million dollars, which we put in a bank and decided to use the interest to finance our project. At that time bank deposits gave 12 percent interest and the price of an airplane ticket to Kyiv was 400 dollars and a week of living in a dormitory of the University of Toronto cost 15 dollars per week.
“Thus the exchange program began working, but in seven years the interest rate on deposits in banks went down from 12 to one percent. Today an airplane ticket from Kyiv to Canada costs 1,000 dollars and a week of living in a dormitory costs 75 dollars.
“However, each year we manage to invite 30 to 40 students to Canada for training. It is possible because some people agreed to temporarily cover the deficit. But in three years this program will be closed because by that time we will exhaust this capital of one million dollars we originally collected.”
Mr. Bardyn have you tried to contact the Ukrainian oligarchs in this matter?
“We twice contacted Mr. Akhmetov. The first time he responded to our letter, although usually oligarchs do not have the habit of responding to letters. At the time of the second appeal, Akhmetov hired a British man as the head of the Foundation, who did not understand the case or maybe received different instructions and therefore they did not support our project after all. There was no response from Mr. Pinchuk it seems to me. Mr. Kuchma also refused to provide assistance to our project.
“We tried to find support in Canada but here various projects are fighting for every dollar. And the people from the generation that gave one million to the project have mostly died by now. Thus, now we have no money to continue our work.
“Last week I was appointed the head of a Canadian organization, through which I will try to convince the Canadian government that they should finance this program for the next 50 years. I would ask them to put, let’s say, 10 million dollars to the fixed fund and finance the program form the interest.”
Why don’t you ask the alumni of this program to send money to this fund?
“They have long begun to do so. But there is still one problem. It is very difficult for Ukrainians to allocate funds for a western foundation because it takes a lot of paperwork and there is a whole complicated procedure to send money here.”
Can you say what impact does this program have?
“Over the past 20 years the achievements of the alumni of this program in both academic sphere and their careers have been outstanding. In the moment that we speak now three alumni are working in the United Nations Security Council in Washington, five – in European Bank for Reconstruction and Development (EBRD) in London, two – in the European Court of Human Rights in Luxemburg, a few alumni are working at the IMF in Washington and London. There are also many alumni now working in Western universities.
“In Ukraine some of them work in NGOs, others initiated their own NGOs, Shyshkin’s daughter was elected to the Parliament. Perhaps, one of the alumni of our program will become the mayor of Lviv. Some of the alumni work in Vitalii Klitschko’s team, others – in the Block of Yulia Tymoshenko. However, we still need another 10 to 20 years to see them show their worth. Only after such period of time, one can see the result of participation in the Canadian-Ukrainian Parliamentary Program. Each year there are meetings of interns held in the Canadian Embassy in Kyiv. Not a single person there would say that three or four months of training in Canada have not changed their outlook.
“Students work inside the Parliament, every day they communicate with their deputy. They see the big difference between the ways the Canadian and Ukrainian parliaments operate. After observing the kind of the relation deputy has with his electorate, they point out that this relation is transparent. Interns of the program are convinced that Ukraine should adopt the Canadian electoral system, where each member of the parliament is elected from a certain district, the way it was done here in Ukraine in majority districts in this year’s elections. Deputies elected by proportional representation feel no responsibility to anyone.
“Many graduates work in law firms in Ukraine that have offices in England or France. There are those, who work in England and the areas of their responsibility are in the countries of Central and Eastern Europe, including Ukraine, where they often go. The total number of the graduates of the program is nearly 1,000.”
Ukraine constantly receives ultimatums to release Tymoshenko and Lutsenko. Does this enhance democratic changes in Ukraine or maybe there should be a different way of talking to the official Kyiv?
“The governments of the Western countries look at the imprisonment of Tymoshenko and Lutsenko solely at the level of political revenge. They do not provide any assessment and do not consider the fact that perhaps Tymoshenko has committed the same kind of crime that Pavlo Lazarenko did. They only look at the fact that one should not use such methods of persecuting one’s opponent just because he or she might win. Government of Canada, not only the Parliament, has almost unanimously put forward a demand to release Tymoshenko and called this political persecution.”
Mr. Bardyn what is your overall impression of the rule of law in Ukraine, where has been Ukraine moving in recent years?
“If to look at the development of the rule of law in England, Ukraine is moving along the same path. The main thing here is that it should not take eight centuries. I see that the rule of Viktor Yanukovych and prior fatal rule of Viktor Yushchenko are the era of development, which took eight centuries in England, but at least here there is no such cruelty that took place in England, when one king beheaded his wife who bore him no sons, then he married a second wife and converted to a different religion. I believe that there won’t be such cruelty and that on the way of our nation in the world we must endure torture and curses until we come to somewhat wiser lifestyle.
“We often hear that we are not ready for democracy and for the rule of law. And I often ask what courses we should complete to be ready for the rule of law. People just think what you are talking about. Don’t be ridiculous. Today our task is not to invent a wheel, but to use it because it already exists.”
How much time does Ukraine need to implement the rule of law?
“Ukraine does not need such a long period of time as it was in England for transition from Soviet lawlessness to the Western concept of the rule of law. It is possible that Ukraine would implement the rule of law the way it was done in Canada without a lengthy period of struggle. However, the demand for implementing the rule of law must come from the civil society, from people and the ruling elite must understand it, even though it now does not understand the meaning of the concept of the rule of law and is not interested in beginning to understand it.”
What can Canada do to help Ukraine in this?
“Canada can help by becoming a closer partner of Ukraine in the sphere of economic, cultural, education, and public relations. Our countries border on large countries. We share some common problems living close to such powerful neighbors.
“Ukrainian language in both countries (Canada and Ukraine) is a means of communication that can and should be used. A few censuses before Ukrainian was the third most spoken language in Canada after English and French. Now the Ukrainian language is behind Chinese, Hindi, Italian, and Portuguese. There is practically no Russian spoken around here. Meanwhile, the Ukrainian language is slowly gaining popularity with the fourth wave of immigration: the number of Ukrainians coming to Canada is about 1.3 million according to the official data, and the unofficial statistics claims there are more than two million Ukrainians. Therefore, the Ukrainian community in Canada is the natural partner of the Ukrainian-speaking population of Ukraine, while the Russian-speaking group living in Canada has no ties with Ukraine.”
What assistance can Canada provide to Ukraine on its way to European integration?
“Canada and the US can do little to help Ukraine in this respect, except for making clear to the Ukrainian government and the Ukrainian people, that if they want to join the EU, Ukraine should meet the standards and laws of the EU community. But most importantly, the Ukrainian government has to make a decision on whether it wants to perpetuate Soviet standards of governance in Ukraine or it still wants to implement and comply with European standards of governance and the establishment of normal civilized country.
“Despite all the hardships I believe in the future of Ukraine. Even in the first week of my stay in the country I saw that it is fantastic only due to one thing – the kind of people who live in this country. There are very strong people with firm principles here. There are many honest and hardworking people. They won’t let anyone to sell them out. They have not allowed anyone to do so in 2,000 years. The power of Ukraine is in its people and they will gain the victory after all.”
